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Monday, June 16, 2008

Has LG15 gone off the rails? Can it be fixed?

by ireact
on Sun Jun 15, 2008 11:42 pm

There was a time when LG15 was not about a bunch of twentysomethings trying to overcome an implausible global conspiracy of religious orders and pharmaceutical companies. Admittedly, that stuff was always there in the background, but I remember when an LG15 video was appealing because it featured engaging characters facing the difficulties of growing up. The series was populated with quirky and unique individuals who created a charming intimacy through talking to the audience about their lives. There was very much a sense of a isolated young people (Bree, Jonas, to a lesser extent Daniel) reaching out to a larger world through YouTube. Bree, Jonas, Daniel, Sarah, Taylor and Spencer really came off as actual people with insecurities, personal weaknesses, passions, idiosyncrasies and unique talents. They could be slotted into character types, but they never felt restricted to them.

I remember being nervous when the show moved from a girl blogging in her bedroom to being about teen fugitives on the run. But the videos managed to maintain the level of intimacy that Bree had achieved in her bedroom. While the Order was certainly present, the series focused on the concept of people thrown together by circumstance and dealing with each other. This was accomplished through really strong writing; standout pieces of work include Jonas' social ineptitude and neediness, Daniel's tentative friendship with Jonas, Bree's growing emotional independence, Emma's shattered innocence, Sarah's sense of alienation, etc.. The writing continued to infuse the characters with very distinct qualities.

Somewhere in the third season, that seems to have vanished, and now the show is really all about hot young actors on the run from a global conspiracy, trying to unravel some aspect of it, generally failing miserably. And it's gotten boring. The team isn't going to overthrow the Order; that would end the show. So there's really no tension or anticipation in the endless Order investigations. Most of the videos now are focused on the TAAG trying to unravel the latest plot, the most recent clue, the next avenue of penetrating the conspiracy, all which is doomed to fail. The characters have become little more than mouthpieces for the ongoing, neverending, perpetually directionless mythology arc. There was a time when the Order was merely the catalyst which caused all these disparate personalities to end up living in the same house. Now the Order has come to define the show and the more we see of the Order, the more boring it is. Amanda Goodfried's appearances stopped being scary a long time ago, and the Order isn't particularly effective if they can't find the TAAG's rented house. The Order is a concept that really needs to stay in the background, because its increased prominence only highlights how the Creators don't have a consistent backstory, purpose or methodology for the villains -- if they even ever bother to come up with one at all. Furthermore, the Order isn't going to be defeated so long as the show is running anyway.

I miss LG15 being about human beings. I miss LG15 being about people trying to make their way through the world and make lives for themselves. I miss LG15 being about growing up and facing a troubling world filled with offputting people. "Redearth88" feels more like LG15 than LG15 has in awhile.

I'm aware that there is apparently a significant level of turnover in the writing department for this series, and that often means that the personal characteristics that were so prominent in characters can often evapourate.

What could be done to set this series right? That question, of course, assumes that you don't like the myth-arc oriented approach, which isn't necessarily the case.

- Ibrahim Ng

Join the discussion: http://www.lg15.com/lonelygirl15/forum/viewtopic.php?f=68&t=17696&hilit=

miles said...
Thanks Anonymous (above) for your defense :) Ibrahim, thank you so much for your insightful comments. I think that lately LG15 has headed in a much more positive direction, and a lot of that is due to Amanda's hard work to "bring it back to its roots." She's been here since the beginning so she gets the importance of character and the "normal" kids vibe the best. It is hard with a large writing team and a lot of turnover, but I personally really enjoyed the Prom videos and felt that it was an example of LG15 at its best: intriguing, character driven, fun, scary, and interactive all in one. Regardless, your points are great and posts like these definitely influence how we approach new shows that we are producing.

20 comments:

  1. I think this is one of the best descriptions iv seen regarding the state of lg15s content now.

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  2. I think this is one of the best descriptions iv seen regarding the state of lg15s content now.

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  3. I agree. The show was so much better when Glenn was one of the writers :/

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  4. LOL.
    When was this written?
    Glenn hasn't done squat in over 4 months.

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  5. Redearth hasn't had a video in over 4 months....

    So I don't think it's the best example anymore.

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  6. The effect Glenn has been able to achieve of vlogging videos that would always allow the audience to know more than Rachel about her situation, and yet still have those myserious unknowns has nothing to do with how long the last video was. :)

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  7. An excellent analysis. LG15 works best when it plays to its strengths: character development and an intimate connection (via the characters vlogging) to an outrageous situation (the Order).

    However, I'm not sure LG15's lost those elements, though they do seem to be on the backburner (especially during the Salinas story-arc).

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  8. It's hilarious how the whole "Glenn factor" comes into these discussions.

    Glenn Rubenstein was nowhere around lg15 at its prime. This whole change in story line that the original poster is saying lead to a "decline" of the lg15 story STARTED when Glenn came on the picture. It was Glenn's involvement that changed the plot and brought the Order to the forefront.

    To compare Redearth, and its few videos spaced months apart to LG15 is ridiculous. There is absolutely no comparison. LG15 is a pioneer, with 3 years of hundreds of videos, that still gets tens of thousands of viewers.

    Redearth is a mere blip on Youtube watched by a handful of people.

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  9. Thanks Anonymous (above) for your defense :) Ibrahim, thank you so much for your insightful comments. I think that lately LG15 has headed in a much more positive direction, and a lot of that is due to Amanda's hard work to "bring it back to its roots." She's been here since the beginning so she gets the importance of character and the "normal" kids vibe the best. It is hard with a large writing team and a lot of turnover, but I personally really enjoyed the Prom videos and felt that it was an example of LG15 at its best: intriguing, character driven, fun, scary, and interactive all in one. Regardless, your points are great and posts like these definitely influence how we approach new shows that we are producing.

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  10. Definitely in agreement that Prom was a return to the character-driven, interactive, web-aware show that LG15 began as.

    Yay Amanda! :)

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  11. I think a vital bond was severed between TAAG and the community when they dumped Steve. That bond has still not been repaired and the show will not recover until the writers take what they did seriously. Just look at the views since that happened. They tell the true story.

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  12. You're welcome Miles, although it wasn't hard to "defend" LG15. I think the awards the show has won are enough validation for what you guys, especially Amanda, continue to produce.

    There are a few Rubenstein groupies that like to put the show down, but, they're STILL watching, so take the criticism for what it's worth -- not much.

    Thanks for all that you guys continue to do.

    FOTM

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  13. glenn was among the lg15 crew from nov 06-march 07, so saying glenn came after lg15's prime ended means the prime was over long long ago.

    the reason glenn comes up all the time in these threads is because people are looking for explanations, and he is the best known lg15 crew member other than the Creators themselves (including Amanda).

    the departure of mesh is probably more significant, though there are many many reasons, not the least of which is that its hard to be excellent over a long time.

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  14. The problem with the order being in the forfront is it is more subject to skeptesism. When it was in the background it could be all powerful ominous and looming behind every corner. Now the order seems more real, and real things have real limitations. It is all powerful yet cant find taag all at the same time, and at times seems more powerful then whole countries, other times less potent the the local thugs. As for the character development, I think it was a real mistake to get rid of gina. Gina and Daniel (and to a lesser extent emma) were the most promising characters on the show. I think the characteristics are still there for daniel (and to a lesser extent shirtless gun brandeshing jonas) they just arent the focus. Sure the order cant die or the show ends, but thats true for many shows. And look at Alias. It "appeared" like the show would end when SD-6 was shut down, but it went on for several more seasons (admitedly this isifferent situation). The point is most spy shows/action shows cant go on once the bad guys are defeated. Look at 24, the bad guys are always defeated by the end ofe season, yet people keep watching.
    In conclusion Im not saying get rid of the order, just shift the focus away from it. It can stay, but it has to stop overshadowing the characters and relationships we love.

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  15. The anonymous Glenn-hater is forgetting two things in his/her argumentation:

    First of all, Glenn left ("was left"?) the show. So while the incorporation of OpAphid possibly started putting the Order more in the foreground, he couldn't end "his" story. How can you blame Glenn for the failure of the Order in the foreground when Glenn never had the chance to end what he started?
    Who knows how the story would look like today if Glenn was still around.

    Secondly, whenever somebody asks "what's your favorite lg-episode?", at least half the answers, usually all, are "The Human Ransom". The "Glenn factor" comes up for a very good reason: You are in the minority. Contrary to your opinion, many people liked the incorporation of OpAphid, as well as Glenn's writing in general. Glenn is responsible for episodes like "The Unthinkable Happened", "Miss Me?", "Interrogation 101", or "The Human Ransom", all of which are pinnacles of the "dark side" of the Breeniverse, and episodes like "Aunt Alex" and "Uncle Dan" introduced characters that influenced the story to a great deal, and are still used today.
    To pretend Glenn's contribution was insignificant and purely consisted of pushing the story off course is either ignorance of the facts, or simply spiteful.

    You say Redearth is a "mere blip" on YouTube. Well, his previous "blip" managed to become the official ARG of LG15. So apparently, enough people in the community, including the Creators, liked his work. Don't you think if Glenn was as untalented as you're trying to pretend, the Creators would never have hired him in the first place? Don't you think had OpAphid been so insignificant, it would never have become the official ARG?

    I understand that not everybody liked OpAphid or Glenn's writing. But to try to blame Glenn for the decline of the story, when he clearly didn't get to finish what he started, is pathetic at best. Milo said it: Glenn left in March 2007. That's over a year, and almost two seasons ago. How exactly are you trying to blame the writing of an entire year and the entire second season on Glenn?
    How are you blaming Glenn for Bree's death, for Mallory, for Emma's touch of death, for the Shadow in the bedroom, for Gina's "death", and so on, and so on?

    Even if you want to argue that his changes were too grave to simply undo them outright - Bree's death was half a year later. If the direction Glenn initiated had really been the problem, Bree's death would have been the perfect moment to entirely change the situation and "undo the damage". The fact that that was not done cannot be blamed on Glenn, and shows clearly that, at least at that point, the "Order in the foreground" setting was favored.

    While I understand that you try to defend the Creators, doing so by blaming the story on someone who hasn't been involved with it for 15 months is simply ridiculous.

    If you disagree with Glenn's time being the prime of the show, fine. But don't blame things on him that he either didn't do, or was even denied the chance to do. FYI, 3rd season story credits go to, Jake Coburn and Ben Kruger, Tom Pettit, Blair Singer, Luke Hyams, Jim Campolongo, and Amanda Goodfried - among several others. If you want to blame anyone for the current direction of the show, blame them. Not someone who stopped working on the show 15 months ago.

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  16. Miles, what exactly is this "more positive direction"? All you seem to have done is kill off all the links to Bree's family (her mom and dad, Bree and her sister) and an FTO campaign that has exposed the Order as a bunch of bumbling fools at best. KM is ending and while prom was shot creatively in the end it failed because it made no sense in the context of FTO. Now they are hanging out at a house where the Order knows their location. If this is what the writers think is a "more positive direction" they have been snorting way too much lonelycrack.

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  17. Well said Model and Brooklyn. I couldn't agree more, I have been with LG15 since the beginning. Although the ups and downs are frustrating; many, many people have continued to stick with the show and its many branches. But I think that the one that the minds behind the camera aren't thinking about is the long lasting reprecussions of the things that they do within the show. Many we disgusted with TAAG after the Steve thing, and it seems as if the characters are becoming stereotypes of themselves at their worst. It is said to see this happen to a show that many people have been watching since the beginning.

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  18. As someone who liked most of the first season, I can see where the anonymous who "defended" the C's is coming from. I have lurked here for a long time on and on off and no matter how good/fun a video is, ever since Glenn's departure people have acted like the show's the worst thing ever. While I don't even watch the new episodes, I still must defend the first season. Aside from the boring leadup to the Ceremony, the entire season was pretty good. And Glenn cannot be given credit for all the positive things while the C's are blamed for everything negative. Nor should the opposite be true. But I'm sure I'll also be called a "hater" just because I don't think Glenn's the ****ing messiah, so I'll be on my way for now.

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  19. Oh, and I'd like to add that I agree immensely with ireact's initial sentiments. I just don't think Glenn leaving has anything to do with the shift in direction. The Vegas episodes, the Bunker Arc, and the introductions of Taylor, Sarah, and Spencer were all pretty good, and they were all post-Glenn.

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  20. "The characters have become little more than mouthpieces for the ongoing, neverending, perpetually directionless mythology arc."

    I think that hit the nail on the head.

    The fact that the show once had a very special relationship between the viewer and TAAG is central to the show working. When they dumped Steve you could literally hear the community snap. It was loud and clear. If the writers think they can repair that with a band aid they are sadly mistaken.

    Either the writers need to start to understand the show/community or it is time to get new writers.

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